De Groot 11.45 ?????

[waynes world]

So then after googling around all i can find is this info and these boats.

So as so many folk on here are well up on where boats and knowledge. Can anybody either link to somewhere to read about hem, or tell me good and bad points on them.

I have been offered a project one with twin Perkins 4108 removed and rebuilt and painted up ready to go back in. the rest is i believe a shell ready for refit.

Just trying to gather info before i visit in a few weeks.

Cheers



Oh yes would be used on UK coastal water and rivers.


Picture / link for reference


Dutch Steel River Cruiser DE GROOT For Sale, 11.45m, 1969

 

[Dino]

I think they were commonly known as the De Groot Palma. You might find more information if you google that. However I think the Palma was a 40ft whereas your boat seems to be 38ft.

 

[Bajansailor]

I am a bit confused Wayne - is the vessel in your photo above the boat that you are interested in?
Or is the photo just for reference (same photo is in the advert) to show what this type looks like?

I love the description -
"De Groot motor cruiser from 1970 with Gardner 6LW engine. Cruises at 640RPM & with a 3m beam swims like a fish. "

They also mention that her last hull sounding was done in 2003 - how old is 'your' boat, and do you know when the hull thicknesses were last measured?

 

[waynes world]

I am a bit confused Wayne - is the vessel in your photo above the boat that you are interested in?
Or is the photo just for reference (same photo is in the advert) to show what this type looks like?

I love the description -
"De Groot motor cruiser from 1970 with Gardner 6LW engine. Cruises at 640RPM & with a 3m beam swims like a fish. "

They also mention that her last hull sounding was done in 2003 - how old is 'your' boat, and do you know when the hull thicknesses were last measured?

Ah my apologies. Yes the one above is of a same boat not the actual one.

I will be getting the hull checked before purchase if i go for it. Thats one thing i wm wonder of the build quality of them, hull thicknes originally.

 

[Wavey]

Can’t comment on the hull thickness but I seem to remember they were sold in various states of completion. IIRC you could even buy them in kit form and assemble the hull and superstructure yourself from a pile of steel plates but someone please correct me if I’m wrong.

 

[dombuckley]

Was about to say the same. There are genuine De Groot built boats out there, which are very well put together. However, in the 70s there was also a UK-based company which produced a flat-pack steel kit for home completion: as you can imagine, the workmanship on these is highly variable. De Groot ended up taking them to court to prevent further copies being made.

As you can imagine, the market value of the kit-built knock-offs are a fraction of a genuine De Groot, so you need to be careful what you are looking at.

 

[PCUK]

Hello Wayne, I built a 12 metre De Groot kit from 1983 to 1987. Sold it in 2012. Still in superb condition With no thickness loss in hull. Check interior hull paint condition and whether it is epoxy. Was boat home built or pro? Some home built ( like mine) were superb, others not so. Twin 4108s will be seriously under-powered for coastal cruising. Expect 6 knots cruising. Mine had 300 hp and managed 12 knots max and 10 knots cruising all day at a gallon a mile. Strongly suggest a pro' survey as this could be a pile of painted rust or a little gem. If you look on you tube you'll find Pershilla on a couple of brokers videos.

 

[n.herring]

Pershilla, now there is a name from the past. Motor Cruiser magazine was it ?

 

[PCUK]

>Pershilla, now there is a name from the past. Motor Cruiser magazine was it ?<

Spot on! Happy days.

Was about to say the same. There are genuine De Groot built boats out there, which are very well put together. However, in the 70s there was also a UK-based company which produced a flat-pack steel kit for home completion: as you can imagine, the workmanship on these is highly variable. De Groot ended up taking them to court to prevent further copies being made.

As you can imagine, the market value of the kit-built knock-offs are a fraction of a genuine De Groot, so you need to be careful what you are looking at.

I never heard of any "knock-off" kits. PG Steelcraft in Twickenham were the UK agent for De Groot and sold both finished vessels and standard genuine De Groot kits which I purchased with all steel pre blasted and epoxy primed to prevent corrosion from the start of the build. Plenty of back-up when required and the Chairman of De-Groot visited my build with Peter Geoffrey from PG Steelcraft as they considered my interior layout to be the best they had seen.

 

[waynes world]

Hello Wayne, I built a 12 metre De Groot kit from 1983 to 1987. Sold it in 2012. Still in superb condition With no thickness loss in hull. Check interior hull paint condition and whether it is epoxy. Was boat home built or pro? Some home built ( like mine) were superb, others not so. Twin 4108s will be seriously under-powered for coastal cruising. Expect 6 knots cruising. Mine had 300 hp and managed 12 knots max and 10 knots cruising all day at a gallon a mile. Strongly suggest a pro' survey as this could be a pile of painted rust or a little gem. If you look on you tube you'll find Pershilla on a couple of brokers videos.

I was thinking the other day two Perkins is vey little foe the boat in the rough stuff. I instantly..like i do though of other engines to stick in her. So yours had twin 150hp ? what engines you recommend to get a better cruise speed ?

Infact 6knots cruise speed isnt so bad towards canal speed i am used to lol.

 

[Megs20Burt!]

I was thinking the other day two Perkins is vey little foe the boat in the rough stuff. I instantly..like i do though of other engines to stick in her. So yours had twin 150hp ? what engines you recommend to get a better cruise speed ?

Infact 6knots cruise speed isnt so bad towards canal speed i am used to lol.

My Dad’s De Groot has twin 150hp engines. Apparently the boat made a trip to Spain under previous ownership and made the Biscay leg well. It was a lovely old thing, but rolled badly??

 

[Croftie]

My previous boat was a 10m Dutch steel with an ageing BMC 2.2 theoretically 50 hp, about the same as Perkins 4108 . At around 2000rpm it did just under 6 knots (very economic), if I pushed it then 7 was just available which was about the calculated hull speed. 12m hull speed should be around 8 knots. For river/canal twin Perkins 4108 should be fine but perhaps a little low for coastal,

 

[PCUK]

I was thinking the other day two Perkins is vey little foe the boat in the rough stuff. I instantly..like i do though of other engines to stick in her. So yours had twin 150hp ? what engines you recommend to get a better cruise speed ?

Infact 6knots cruise speed isnt so bad towards canal speed i am used to lol

I had a single 300hp Cummins 6BTA M2. Reckoned to be one of the best diesels available and the cheapest to rebuild. All marine parts readily available from Cummins truck dealers.
I also had a 30hp BMC 1.5 wing with a folding prop which gave 5 knots max. With both engines running flat out and over-revving like mad she would get on the plane at 14 knots. Only for a minute or so occasionally!

 

[amjams]

Ah my apologies. Yes the one above is of a same boat not the actual one.

I will be getting the hull checked before purchase if i go for it. Thats one thing i wm wonder of the build quality of them, hull thicknes originally.

Can the hull thickness be measured from the Inside presumably using some kind of ultra sound electronics gizmos?
I ask because I'm looking at buying a 42 foot at the moment and the price of the survey plus lifting her out of the water makes it possibly not worth it

 

[amjams]

Btw, please excuse my bad manners, I'm not up with the etiquette on these sites, but hello, and pleased to be here, my name is Anthony

 

[waynes world]

Can the hull thickness be measured from the Inside presumably using some kind of ultra sound electronics gizmos?
I ask because I'm looking at buying a 42 foot at the moment and the price of the survey plus lifting her out of the water makes it possibly not worth it

Hi Anthony

Welcome over.

To get a hull thickness check you need to get it lifted out as its mainly below the waterline, or just about below to be checked. Thats the worst area for corrosion. And still you need to get the lot checked on these old boats. otherwise you mat well waste a lot more in the future. And yes ultrasound is ow it is done and no doubt other ways nowadays.